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WWL>Topics>>12-6 1pm Steven Sheffrin

12-6 1pm Steven Sheffrin

Dec 6, 2010|

Spud talks to Steven Sheffrin, Executive Director of the Murphy Institute at Tulane about lawmakers attempts to strike a deal on expiring tax cuts

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Automatically Generated Transcript (may not be 100% accurate)

All -- renegade -- they want. We're not talking football -- other than just gold goes saints who day -- that's who. 2670. Is our number here though 866889087. Or toll for -- got a good show -- and I think we're gonna start out talking. With Steve -- news executive director of the year Murphy instituted to -- university's professor of economics there we're gonna talk Olympia. The deal that they're currently striking are talking about between now. Tax cuts and extension -- -- employment benefits and I have had I have seen the somebody called me last week can say this that. Unemployment benefits stimulate the economy more than tax cuts do. I don't see how that works frankly I don't get it and I mean I've heard the guy who explained it to me last week. But the problem is here is the money from. I don't understand if someone asks -- you must -- from those very questions and we'll talk about. -- the tax cuts as and and the unemployment benefits. 2 o'clock we're talk we're judge Frederico wicker and this Circuit Court of Appeals he's. Justice gantry designate to Louisiana sentencing commission we're gonna talk about the state Louisiana California. Had just been ordered not just imminent or has been there for awhile on the -- and around I don't and I guess. They're about to release 40000. Prisoners 40000 the state Louisiana has 40000 incarcerated and and and percentage wise population wants we have the highest percentage of incarcerated people here last week we spoke about the guy who. Who club there -- the camp to -- got five years somebody called me up and told me her son got killed by drunk driver got six years. So what we'll talk about is how old. Fair is the sentencing guidelines here and should we beat incarcerating last. And community service and more so a judge where pro drumming on Nauman. And then. Bennett fled 3 o'clock we'll open up wants and also commented on the Supreme Court decided to. To listen to a case about whether some women who were suing Wal-Mart for gender discrimination whether or not should be a class action suit but we'll also basically ask the question here. Equal pay for equal work do you feel like you're getting short changed do you even know if you get short changed how can we fix that or is that a part of of capitalism that on the salaries should be negotiated then you should negotiate for higher salary so open up a -- for that. In the meantime though let's get to our first guest today Stephen -- and his executive director of the Murphy institute has. Murphy's law of an air I don't I don't think -- that -- not and I you know I'm -- every time I get like every. Every Monday and Thursday morning and I get in the elevator over here and talk to people -- I -- -- did not win the -- need to. As they come in their Trojan and a worker that look gonna thanks. But we are now I -- in the congress I haven't seen that absolute lie and it's up to the minute news but. It looks like there's going to be a compromise. Between. The bush tax cuts extending them and extending unemployment benefits. Me personally I'm in favor of extending both of them. -- but. I guess I should. I'm somebody who is not in favor of lame duck sessions is what I'm in favor of so frankly this last minute scrambling. Wobble while this congress is still in session I'm against that they -- taking care of the stuff before the election so that's my first gripe. This is not something that should be coming down to the wire because I think they're both two important. But I'll I'll I'll go from there -- how is this. How was this going to to affect -- against somebody just had numbers what 700 billion dollars if you make 300000 dollars -- -- -- -- 900 dollars -- and conscious and. I think I agree with you actually that I think at this point it's probably useful to you. Combine the unemployment insurance which the hour extension of the tax rates unemployment insurance so put about 56 billion dollars into the economy. And that'll lead to a some boosting GDP. And the same is true kind of with the tax -- that the one danger apathetic. Down the road you can't keep extending unemployment insurance benefits could potentially people are. It's actually the facts are on people's decision to work will will kick and so I think the -- we've already extended their. The 99 this is actually going further match but I I think we probably need it right now. I think things are things server or you know some -- -- the -- the weeks earlier deployments are on. Two thirds of the benefits do go to families that will be twice the poverty line is not really up poverty program but it will be a good stimulus program. In terms of the tax cuts I think you know given the fragility economy. I think we can put this down to -- on the road and then take our chances there and then we'll see what we won't -- we gonna do. I I think -- be the state down the road just to raise tax rates I think maybe within a couple years we'll have the chance to consider real tax reform. We get rid of some loopholes to lower their rates could have been much better for the economy. And that's that's. I tell you that's the biggest -- right now the the actual our tax laws in this country -- so. I don't use the word draconian because I'm not even sure that applies because they're just they're they're littered. It's this it's a stack above pages that by the time you finish reading they're changed anyway. It's sometimes people think well the tax code has in the senate and so forth. -- the average person. -- either pay someone to do their taxes we're like myself try to -- on computer and Turbotax or something. I have no idea what the incentives are I barely know my marginal rates are there any -- cases it's become a kind of -- But you do know that the higher the rates GC. People particularly the higher income level you'll start sheltering their money to -- -- tax exempt bonds higher -- and we'll do all sorts -- -- just not gonna get the the money that you expect. I think I think I'm glad you're just. I think we put -- camera for two years. To combat to the fact that we do need some stimulus for the economy. And many cheers and hopefully we can think about restructuring the tax system. You know Reagan did it it would you know this might be a good time for Obama tries to guard -- Well I agree because of some of the arguments -- gotten from people when it's only the top 2% that are whining and crying and so we should stick it to them well first off. No I mean that things shouldn't and things need to be fair across the board what does -- now what is my incentive to work hard and become one of those 2%. If I'm gonna have to listen to someone like you go let me stick it to me -- pay all the bills but number two. They hear that argument to. And they have the funds to do just what you said to either shelter their money to invested overseas which isn't doing us any good here I mean they need to. Yet with with the extension of these tax rates tax cuts whatever they are they need to spend the next two years figuring out and especially now's the time to do it because you -- You've got the senate and the and the president in one party and you got the house and another party so now you got no option. But to try some kind of a compromise across the board now under -- program. Who blueprints put out last few weeks by they know that the -- since the commission has some good ideas in there even even someone like Dick Durbin news have pretty liberal on the senate. Basically had endorsed the idea of coming back as -- right now if you'll still affects some popular people immediately they took away some of the mortgage interest deduction. The way they would probably do it it was they say -- deducting -- -- 39% rate for a 37% rate. -- conducted at a 28% rate. But nonetheless that he could bring down the top -- as well you know as part of that deal. I think I'd be very beneficial for for a lot of people did little tricky right now given. How housing is quite. I think all these things can be done enough to think that they're gonna have to come to grips. In more direct way we have. Exclusion of health insurance from -- pretax too because that's one of the things I think. Fueling the demand for more insurance and and so of course I think those things -- have to be tackled I think they can be tackled by -- He need to write political Margaret and maybe he suggests a mixed party in -- market the best way to do it. Well is because. I mean I don't have all the history written notes in front of me but it seems to me every time this kind of stuff happened they did it with. With bipartisan bush I mean you got an inside their thoughts when they're outside their thoughts. They got together they hammer something out that seemed to work the best they're. When you've got one party rule I mean we just have one party rule for two years and end and -- a lot of people didn't like it that is why the house was taken over by the. Six tax reform is Reagan was was present to -- had been taken over by the Democrats at that point. And so people like Bill Bradley. And and -- apart from the health Bill Bradley from the fact we had had they were very important players there. And they were Republicans like Bob Packwood who were very important -- we really want to -- a bipartisan. Better not be enough talk about it and there hasn't been a lot of talk recently about about the tax reform I think that's something that I think people get their arms around because you're not. -- it's pumping up which everyone can benefit where judges saying oh the people here the people there are making too much money report. I've done just singer Chuck Schumer put out. I he had the detection don't apply to people above a million. And that's probably because blood constituents in New York if you make 25300000. Dollar in New York guilt for all that rich and it's gonna get. May look -- a year -- -- could talk about people that paid 3540000. Dollars a year. Justin went out and whenever for a cold water war. The answer but it has -- so it's all in the eyes of the holder the other thing I think it's really important which doesn't get discussed and not. It 88 it is true that. Intraday including their increasing income equality over the last fifteen years so -- if you look -- really really carefully. It's actually the people in the top 110 of 1%. And make it to people about like fifteen million dollars to sell. It's very can have gone out of the average Porsche who's making 252 let's say a million and I'm not not too important not doing bad news which a little fire -- But I don't want to really gain -- at the very very very top. And that's because of the way the financial system has been structured in the way we know -- the way we hope reward and CEO of the things like that. -- do little to do with the aggregated impact popular. -- migraine attack and look at look they're the ones who. Who who benefited most of that the one they're the ones who basically going over some of the golden parachutes. Who makes -- millions of dollars and then. Even if they're even if their company folds they still walk away which won a million dollars of in -- Salman -- -- on these are the ones that we bailed out where taxpayer dollars in the other ones Pena. But you know the I think the American people have off to a fast -- Last night on sixty minutes the return again there's Ben Bernanke. Talked about how fragile economy -- and there was the commitment FaceBook with them there. And left with all the the current beating known for heavy -- which is try to doctor is 26 year old Leo multi multi multi billionaire. As the saying married people kind of admire him too so I think the American people out of a mixed feeling about the very rich at times they microarchitecture -- but it certainly -- what is this twenty fictional case there -- To be my kids can do it arena it me or neighbors can can do it. They had a kind of mixed feelings I think. Well I agree he. You know sometimes though a look at some items that went to remove a -- -- -- hang onto your. But gonna keep in other segment I got a blue collar line and appear wanna ask your questions and make an estimate and I don't bomb. But. I mean really at the end of the day this FaceBook guy. You know what you got. You got a whole bunch of people talking to each other Americans with ma bell to -- so this guy may multi billions and I don't I got my wife. And I and those but most show we have a FaceBook page and I understand though. The the blue the posit the ability of getting a message out. But me personally I don't want I talk on the radio three hours a day I'm on the stage. I don't know what else you need to know about me I got a settlement competitor you have but anyway but at the end of the day is so folds Ken Ken Ken -- I get out of FaceBook and live -- get out of -- -- cannot drive and no way can I eat it you know. Meaning Tammy billions of dollars on some pictures on the screen that if you don't have electricity can usually it Patrick about it iTunes six when it's -- out I -- -- got. These -- and these different is our guest. Executive director of the Murphy instituted -- university professor of economics and we're talking about. Leo bush tax cuts were talking about the the extension of unemployment there was talk about. Tax rates in general and whether or not this is a good idea and what we need to do in the future for. Basically. Get lost 260187866. Skating event through its revenue up over my -- pick up call for. We're back on but showed just 6018786688. That -- -- -- -- -- -- toll -- line. My guess is being Sheppard David shepherd is the executive director of the Murphy institute who was Murphy. -- he was -- US. And so it was the son of the founder of -- -- -- who wanted donated funds to Tulane. -- -- -- -- -- -- And we studied politics economics philosophy and we're moving in the public policy now so we're we're we're growing and where important part of doing. So you all and and Murphy and anybody has access is this the specific when Murphy raw. Okay so yell just dollar -- a think tank. We're we're we're a think tank and we also do we out of an undergraduate major program that doing can't. Cool all right let me ask you one more time to explain and then go straight to the phone so hang on -- you're gonna come -- -- that. This guy called me last week I heard of her closely say this I think it hurt Carey John Kerry say this that. Unemployment benefits stimulate the economy and as the congressman said that to unemployment benefits stimulate the economy. More than tax cuts do my argument is that. Beyond that I am in favor of extending the unemployment right now because the winners coming on and -- the holidays are here. I mean a lot of times people you know get jobs at the qualities but frankly it's going to be hard not to find a job in this economy anyway especially trudging through the so. So I'm in favor of extending them at least till the spring. But somebody who does yet unemployment benefits I'm sure -- -- Saban that their spin and at their paying their bills. But that money right now is being. Created whereas tax cuts though less money the government takes from me I am able to. Eight pay down some more my debt and the more -- -- I paid on the more money I spend the more I give to charity so the more the less money they take from me the more money I have in the more money I have. Which is earned by me. I use that to stimulate the economy so I -- where my where my right or wrong. -- appreciate it. In a very short run to pay the unemployment insurance benefits. The work we cut taxes that -- in both cases we were borrowing the money selling bonds for Republican barring a money. And it's probably true that the people unemployed spent in the -- slightly higher fraction of it and the people we're getting a tax cuts but it's not that big difference so. What blows the end and -- people are saying. They're basing in on the congressional budget analysis sent the people who -- game unemployment benefits of spent little bit more. Tony what people the pictures easyJet. If you extend unemployment benefits for too long to discourage people going back and labor force and working if you raise tax rate to talk to gonna discourage people. From taking these extra job doing extra work and an off -- people start shopping their income and today so it's only for the short run. That you might one -- extending unemployment insurance benefits again we've already extended credit bad time I -- pushing beyond. Yeah beyond that beyond the time you're talking about maybe for the year I think actually the actual limit -- remember running into dangerous ground were two were were destroying incentive. Right -- the concert to six Sony seventy. Pat in match for your first up on WW out. One thing that I asked of ten questions about that gentleman is the lobbyist in Washington. He probably put everything from the fact we hit what 300 no top on it and 37. Elected officials and lawyers and night. Hundred. And to put 35. To execute acted as a -- out. Take spent three point nine billion dollars last year on those. 500 series and people want. Can't we need it now. You have a big government. The government makes a lot of decisions if EPA make big decisions -- history in various ways. You know if if congress that they think they can healthcare it effects the drug industry that doctors the hospitals and so forth. And you know when government gets big people on the private sector one one to protect their interest I think nothing wrong with that as long as there's no secret if you will on both sides. Because people have a private I think I personally think that. Money spent on lobbying is fair to protect your interest in my experience I was a -- no one here in many cases people in the private sector. Actually a little bit more about their business so what's going on and people in the government and so a lot of what the best lobbyist. Are actually educating the congressman -- -- is corruption and graft and so forth you know we're all familiar with that. But a lot of a lot of this is simply saying well gee you know -- a government take one action gonna have a big impact and history we will make sure people know about that and they think through the consequent. I hello. What I I understand that but. Giving so much money. -- one year but these congressmen and senators and the president and group. It's not in the pie and allow. And I mean I I did what I get this gentleman that you blocked -- but I don't like -- -- -- from the -- system and -- Block because of lobbyists he giveaway that -- -- still in Gulfport Mississippi. Fundamentally. Could you give it to he gave it to private enterprise. To go back to these -- but I didn't think it but yeah I'm against Colombian. Who have the power of the government at this. Can tell me that. Make it obvious and a politician who get their money. Isn't right. It legally could -- -- people at. Rule -- it's also it's also First Amendment I tell you what one thing the subprime gotta I gotta step when Julia and do via. The news and one of the things that that the Supreme Court did and and is still don't drug contention between the president and the Supreme Court was the a vote you know -- corporations and unions and everybody else they can donate money to. You know causes and I'll tell you the truth. I'm against that the only people who should be able to donate the only thing. Entity that should be able to donate to political causes or people themselves and the people who walk into a voting Booth and vote. As that as that if I wanna give my money to a packed and my names on the list because I know exactly what that pact is doing and why they're there. Well that's a different thing you know I am I'm still get my money but to have you know a corporation. Itself right a check out of myths. Dividend fund or whatever. I'm just not in favor that because that's not people let the stockholders themselves. Get up and write a check. You know where has that affect their street. I mean that's about the tough political issue 01 point George will have this notion that that he sent. No limits on on on spending and full disclosure. But of course under this current Supreme Court ruled was not full disclosure. I feel a little ambivalent I'd I do think I do think that that we stand basically. The amount of money we spend on and campaigned for example if sort of amount of money we spend on twinkies -- or something like that it's not a great fraction economy. But somehow I I also do feel that should be more disclosure. Nobody also I'm and I got to go -- -- and don't don't know where is Steve dog -- romantic but I think -- it is -- -- I've -- in the numbers and frankly. But 90% of the time whoever spends the most money wins not always but mostly. And it I hang on Christmas in the newsroom be back -- more your calls on the spurs are residents. A long time ago but he's answering questions. I can't answer and -- got a bunch of callers so he can stay one more segment so let me squeeze everybody in minicamp -- in -- hey Greg thanks for -- -- and a Libya. Thanks but I guess now's Greg Buchanan I Garland show an ethics even become -- really into my question. And it concerns that the bush tax cuts -- -- excellent job. According in my calculations if someone makes clear a thousand dollars and has about 20000 dollar deduction. It would that pay about 900 dollars a year born taxes at 500000 dollars this somewhere around 6600 talks. -- million dollars it's about 20000 dollars I guess my question is. You know Skype makes to have fame boxer and he gets another 5600. This second really stimulate jobs saw how that -- that way. There's two effects really that's going on one is is will he spend the money. And that sent the team in effect that's very very short run effect an effect and it was he thinking about it terms of taking on extra consulting project. We're doing sexual were or or moving money around to the government doesn't get all the extra funds. You know frankly we won't veto the Bill Clinton rates that would we're talking about bringing back in. It's not in Eric -- is even effective rates were went back up to level. It would be the end of the world but that it but I do think they have in importance -- fact. And -- a couple of years under the health care bill there's going to be another 3% on top of that because tacked on to obscurity. I and the Medicaid tax. And so now there's been at that point you're getting up to some higher levels of people are gonna make certain decisions not wanna work and and and move their money remembers where. And I think that's what people are kind of refrain of not so much the initial. Increase here is what the facts about the drift tax policy and what you can start government. You know -- on the business and you -- 6000 dollars and even 121000 people who -- 33%. For raw. For the minute medical bill wouldn't really affect my decision well behind someone and not -- -- -- as a matter of when they make the company more money in the long run. I and then that's an active debate among economists and and and and there are people who are more. There's of the diversity of opinion on that there's some people who -- great refused saying that. At the levels that we're talking about that the Rangers were talking about if not gonna matter that much pretenders there's other economists who think it matters a lot more. I sort of feel in the in in the militarized -- I I think effect. The potential for sheltering the money. I can be greater and I think this question of perception that the government getting too big and so forth I and the weary I go in the future I think is a real concern. IN and that's very true and and and and the Saddam and we sometimes when you look at the way it's on immigration law by may first of only 300 K a year. But 900 bucks to me is 900 bucks to make and I would rather spend 900 bucks and give it to the government which is already too big as far as I'm concerned so it's not mean I got. I saw the YouTube video John Kerry Senator Kerry on the for the sensing that the government is better able to spend the money the new war. And I'm going -- all the ones who were in charge you been in Washington inside the beltway for decades. -- the one who's been there the whole time and and now we're in the boat that -- in I mean presidents come presidents go but they got people Bennett in the inside beyond the beltway making decisions on policy in passing laws. For decades and I mean why would I want to give you more money. When you're one of the reasons we're where we're and. Agree with that but that's the -- that's a different issue the issue with those. They'll -- -- a tax -- to generate jobs and that doesn't seem like that it would have been much effect. Hello well eventually just change arguments ago well whether or not they'll generate jobs I've given you enough money -- much into it and I don't wanna give you anymore. What that would that change your argument then I. I looked at that they can Greg -- for a while -- on the air with the the Congressional Budget Office estimate of one two year extension would be. Of -- tax cuts for everybody and also just to the middle income -- from individuals and you know that. The amount we're talking about if that is maybe seven to eight tense GDP. For each year that's. That's a reasonable amount and interest earning for the higher income people if that's probably -- -- -- the intent is probably quarter of the fact. So we're not talking with a rough off facts. But -- factor at least according to crucial budget office. Which focuses only on the spending and not on the incentive effects pedal says it's it's the detective deep cuts for the rich are still about a quarter of the effectiveness of -- country -- -- Greg I appreciate it thanks -- -- keep rock general -- this rainy and I'll pick you also ranked. Hey I don't what's -- no limit at the other got five man it's -- question. Well I wanna comment on some with the compensation then. And I just wanna take into been here 52 years in my life been keeping up with politics for most of that time. And I had several issues one album Social Security should have been put in a lockbox. Kinda fits into it it's solvent now and go insolvent. Because they keep playing with the money. Well if if anything. Is currently -- You meet the wife acute. Event might -- now. They go play with it if you got it in that -- -- -- a pitcher -- your fan. I agree I'll see what you say and I don't know Steve what -- Well I mean -- remaining there for many colors it parent that we have on the done that at with the administration where are they most state income tax for his first two terms. I like that why not paying no taxes so understand -- live that way. Also. Business and things were going so well. The state got more money generated from business. Well as the economy went down -- -- in. Would. We -- employees are in the -- federal. Maybe federal. Budget in trouble for many different reasons. All their right mind. Would would want any tax. Suspended on any sector. Of the population. Think about it. We got thirteen trillion into it the calm down. That is to each of the recipients there is clearly the long run and moderate debt problem -- -- we've been talking about today in most let's with a focus -- congress. Is focusing on the -- recession. The trick is how can you and it's very hard thing to do he can't we need to spend more money now. To prevent the economy from collapsing and -- or or or prevent it from getting worse. And I understand that argument and the other hand he's saying briefing at the long in the long run we're gonna have to actually cut spending or just our tax rates or something. In order to figure out how to do it. You know everywhere -- -- Washington -- agree will these -- two distinct problems. But it's gonna be difficult to navigate -- is always pressure you know for one finger for another to spend the money now. Coming to grips with the deficit is another issue so. And hopefully. I'm an optimist within a within a couple years -- said the economy be coming back to speed. We'll be getting closer to four point -- capacity at that point we really you have to attack would have. Prominent optimist too but I'm not hearing coming back you know I'm. Or jobs coming back that quick in two years so I mean look. Years according to the feds do the unemployment rate but still unemployment there are still be around 8%. -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- And that the one disturbing fact about the recession now -- looking -- people and after a long time the percentage of long term unemployment could actually quite all right. And I agree with the power in the sense that we really do have to worry about the long term deficit. But if we had a draconian policy now probably not extending benefits and raising taxes I think it could have a bad short term jolt the economy. And that's why is that the that the Fed they're engaging in these kind novel new policies because they're really concerned that there will be much action on the fiscal side and they got to keep the economy afloat. -- Steve and I appreciate it and I know you gotta go attempt to longer than you were supposed to not precise bit brighter I hear about it we're taught to -- -- but I. -- a small business owner well we just talked Red Robin let things hang on here your calls we get back from sports on there. Gonna push our next. We'll talk with the judge Frederico win her fifth Circuit Court of Appeals. And we'll talk about why. -- so many people are incarcerated at. And for how long and or should we be reevaluating. The sentencing guidelines here in the state and across the country. 2601 late seventies and -- Bob in metric things running and about the next under the Rio. -- -- not well. This year I think I'll make about a 140000. But frankly. I would brother. Personally pay period frequent -- actually. You know I had. Record crop supports are that -- -- rich don't pay any taxes at all. I just suspect appears make it up by toward you which can do. To hide your money you make it an -- it's not a fair game with a poor guy in the middle. Well that's why I'm a fair tax guy which frankly would eliminate. Massive amounts of stuff and give you no reason and no ability to hide your money use you would pay your tax when you buy stuff. And that's sit there wouldn't be any more loopholes because there there's not that you want you go buy something you have to pay the tax you don't -- it it's actually don't get the stuff and the story. Yeah. I don't know what they're yeah. I can show off and on income but it seems like you're speakers and there are. By and large are all the right wing of fish. Are at war all oil market partnership that anybody ever ever seen. I think it should come out of the club that on the issue and not pretend bigger charge to be -- -- ballots. You're kind of like Fox News speaker Sheldon beneath portraits though right it's been all into the river. And yet I'll have another caller call up and tell me on the Ferris guy on the radio. So. You know that's obviously not your opinion. I try to be fair I never made any any secret of the fact that I leaned farther right than I do left. Socially I leaned more to the left the most of the the of the people of more than though those boob talk show to talk show hosts are there aren't you know that's who I am I'm never hidden it from anybody don't claim to be anything anything on the -- not. And then when I -- So don't you know bears. There's your opinion you don't think I'm fair or somebody else does. You know what I'm just gonna keep doing what -- do in just leave it go back. Thanks to call 2670. -- way back tomorrow right impetus to. Lawmakers may strike a bipartisan deal tax cuts for everybody in exchange for extending jobless benefits for the long term. Unemployed is that a good or bad compromise 54% of you saying good. 46%. Are saying a bad cop and I think it's good because quite frankly that's their job is to get apparent compromise. However I'm still an answering the question was asked before. About whether or not so on the term unemployment will benefit will will extend more money than. Then tax cuts in a short term yes but this post Gupta thinking about the long -- two and and quite frankly I would rather keep more -- and a -- keep more money money. Because I've seen what they do when they spend it and frankly as far as I'm concerned they're too big and they need to start shrinking. So there you go. Anyway. Next hour judge Fredricka wicker is gonna -- issues fifth -- on a fifth Circuit Court of Appeals she's. Justice give juries who does -- okay. She is justice give trees designated to Louisiana sentencing commission justice injuries were -- Europe. -- Chief Justice Louisiana Supreme Court the Louisiana sentencing commission. Last week we spoke about the guy who killed the -- with a shovel. Who got five years who complain he said because the other three people involved at two years of probation basically a slap on the wrist. He's the one into going to jail for five years a lady called up and said that her son had been killed by a drunk driver. And that guy had only been sentenced to six years. So they didn't think that was fair I don't know if it's fair or not that's what we're gonna talk about the state of California has been ordered. Buying. A federal judge to release 30% of the people that they have incarcerated in this state that's about 40000. Convicts 40000. Convicts. The argument. About why. Is because they have so many first off they that is almost twice the number of people but they have facilities built. To actually howls convicts. That others begala -- what a modern. Current thirty plus thousand more than an hour I have to figure. But thirty well 30% of will be roughly 40000 that they are gonna have to release because they they -- have more convicts than they have space. Plus more convicts than they are able to provide. Just your standard not special just regular medical mental health care. And they have people dying every day there because of a medical problems are from suicides. So federal judge's order them that they have to release 40000 in this there's no arguing across abort my argument and asked -- -- -- record comes on here. Next hour is. Do should we are we incarcerating too many people are too many people going to poke you're gonna have the same argument over here but somebody don't -- and a four days in jail. Because they have all but an eight year old. Broken tail light warrant out on them is that just it I mean if the actual. Sentence for a crime like that is not in jail term. Why should they be picked up and taken to jail on -- on an ancient -- and across the board. You know should I mean somebody caught without you know -- less than an out so you know what go to jail. I mean it's one thing and got two pounds. But if they just got a little bit. I mean should we be holding up our our jail time our incarceration. Inside prisons for people who were actually -- true. Danger to the community. Basically should we be instead of incarcerating people should we be re looking at it and getting instead. Community service. Let him stay home let them work. So that there are contributing a set us paying for the three hots and -- cut their -- in her own but also give them.

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