I want to first thank the silver -- society for joining us about last hour. These guys are making a difference. We need to help raise these young men and they are doing and not just young men. As a gentleman and of the future fathers of our time but also they're going to appreciate education. It's just a wonderful program I'm so glad that they cannot come on and talk about it but we are moving on now to something that a lot of people are talking about. Why has governor Bobby Jindal flip flopped on common core. Why would he object to it when he once fought to instill it in Louisiana schools. After being one of the biggest proponents of common core the governor now says he is quote. Sensitive to the control the federal government would have about how and what we teach our kids. Where did that come for a the governor is trying to negate the will of not only the state legislature. But the best seaboard and the man he wanted as leader of the Department of Education John White. What is going on is this all about the governor's pursuit of the White House. Well let's talk to some people who are very concerned. Not just about the politics. But about the goal raising the standards of education in the state. Joining us in studio is -- Jacobs. Founder of educate now and a former -- board member for twelve years under two governors. Stan Smith who was the interim superintendent. Of Orleans parish schools. Doctor James mesa superintendent of Jefferson -- schools. And by phone thank you so much Jeremy -- offered. Publisher and editor of -- politics weekly I want to thank each and every one of you for taking time out of very busy days. To just kind of clueless and I always open this of course to anybody who has. Interested in the issue of what's going on with common -- don't hesitate to give us a call 260187. Day. It's really based the show on. He vetoes it. Down to the last second we had -- five days before navy did vetoed it. John White was in the studio and he said very very clearly there. Regardless of what happens we are going to implement common core it was crystal clear. And it's in now in hindsight I think he must have known. But he is forging ahead. I'm going to ask the three -- you and Jeremy is well what is going. Well take a stab lane and now. You -- I think for the for your listeners. A little bit of a primer on what is common core. You start -- was standards and standards are many ways apple time mother and it's what we expect students to know when vehicle to do. Prior to 2010. Each state had their own set of standards and it was very frustrating. For businesses that operated multi state for governors and there was no way to compare student performance. So the the the impetus for these common course standards actually came out of the National Governors Association and a group of business leaders national -- In 2010 -- adopted these standards. After the standards what we expect students now -- be able to do comes the curriculum. Now the curriculum is actually guide to what is taught in the classrooms so if the standard says. Students need to read aid aid be able to read a biography of nonfiction. And be able to answer questions about it the teacher can -- Which materials they want in the classroom. There is no national curriculum. There's no state curriculum that some teachers want it there is however curriculum guides to help teachers know what type material to -- Then there's the text. Now the test measures how well have students mastered these standards. The governor. And his. Press conference and his executive orders and his letter sent one I'm pulling out a common course standards the fact is he cannot. And then subsequent messaging I think he's acknowledged that Bessie constitutionally. Has the right to do the standards. In less for some reason the legislature worked to by law. Require something different the legislature rejected all efforts secession to require something different. So the governor cannot force -- to adopt new standards. To. Is the test because again there's no state curriculum to deal. What the governor where the battleground now resides is a governor is pulling out all stops and mom would say either using or abusing. His executive power. To try and prevent. The state board of education and the Department of Education from using park. Which is one of the two tests that were designed by this consortium of states and then his executive border he said you cannot buy anything. That was built by a consortium of states he's trying to prevent park and -- or Smart Balance which is the other one. And he's using the division of the administration's. Power over contract review he has suspended the contract of the testing company of the -- Testing banter when you do attest it's more than just question to have to assemble the tests to grade the task to do their ratio analysis. So there's been a testing Bender. Through. Through eight procurement process approved by the division administration in place since 2003. And the governor has suspended their contract right now. Are amazed he has the right to do. Well I think that's gonna ultimately to be decided by a court the reason -- it is I mean this is a legally valid contract. Approved by the division of administration that has been effect since 2030. So I think that's gonna be a matter for the courts to interpret. Let me just ask the governor has said publicly that he -- listening to various groups is very specific it's the Tea Party it's this it's that. And he has his concerns and -- The question I keep hearing from others is is he not been listen. To the legislator legislature who is representing many voices. And not listening to people like you and others administrators. He just discounts that because he is focused on that small group. Anyway -- don't care. But this is -- Hewitt in the governor. Personally what was certainly absent from this legislative session on comical or he did. -- show up and and and that -- courts. State in the governor's stance that that you know -- he was mostly action in terms of providing any real guidance and that's. That's that they're declaring mission are from all of this is that the governor. You know it has yet to present any -- of alternative plan to take the place. The Sanders and the testament studies Tenet. Kick in the cannery Tibet into legislature -- and mulch. Rejecting anti war comic or policy. I don't think it's pretty clear that -- most political observers that. It is a political calculations and then in the united mine out of -- it's just pretty risky. Thank you governor is. It's just taking his business and industry. -- an -- You -- switching course on the element. -- -- Dominant in Iraq -- what Germany because -- -- I've got your latest in hand I was struck by this. Quote. Excuse me you quote Elaine great thing. Great -- grizzly being is the founder and board chair of painting contractor -- says. The good business community has denounced Bobby Jindal were not turning our backs on him that would suggest that will forget about them. Business will not forget I will not forget I don't intend to give up on it because young Jindal wanted to have national ambitions and screw over our children. That's a quote from him. In your latest article. Do you sense that -- this that this is representative of the business community and how they're feeling. I think I think at that point of this feeling from. From the rank and file is going to be interest and Nancy with what it was -- association the industry right now. They are holding pattern there waiting for John White teens that kinda makes sense of everything I think -- it corrected and that. Several these these. Issued an independent courts Serena spoke to a lawmaker after division administrations and that -- Under contract for -- -- And they just flatly say you know that this you know we're -- company that. To watch that are that are contract gets suspended and and not take it to court. You know but but aside from from. In going against business and industry yet or -- or carry the water should -- business sloppy you know he also to. Bonds and so some strange bedfellows that. Some but not all the the teacher unions in -- are supporting the governor's -- A lobbyist grant after the press conference basilica the governor's. Thrown his lot in that with the status quo which is this term that the government use this crop but opponents of it is teacher change here and Belcher programs and the same people who do an excellent governor burst past education that -- that there are currently outstanding. And I think it is -- -- which with the with the Tea Party. Types and I think governor recognizes that. And in between the lawsuits and and and sitting business and industry it's just for example on the first partnered. I don't think there ought to realize that the decision that teammate. Last week to -- well last has. It is term as governor. I want everyone to stay with us we're gonna continue this talk on comic former gonna talk to two superintendent. And have their input to what does it mean for next fall right after this I'm Angela under the WM so we are back talking common. And if it had many chapters actually since the day we started to show I think it was the number one. Show people wanted to hear. Anyway. We're talking with -- Jacobs doctor James Mason and Stan Smith. And also Jeremy Alfred -- -- like to go to doctor James Mason Stan Smith both of superintendent doctor. -- with Jefferson -- on soaring stand Smith with New Orleans. But talk to me about how this is going to impact you got school of a couple of months. And now go first you know we've already made the determination that we're gonna move forward with the what our plans is as we as as we have the last five years this is a five year investment for us we started. 2000 NTN. Towards implementation of the common course standards in developing the curriculum. And to you know to do something different at this at this point. You know what would be foolish to our teachers are trying to we finally got to the point where our curriculum is developed. And and and we're ready to move forward with this and you know you that you don't just drop an initiative. In the middle or at the end of an initiative view view you move it forward in tweak it to make sure it works and that's what -- that's what we're gonna did. Jefferson Parish several years ago and -- had a clear vision that we were going to raise the bar. -- follow up performances. Concord. Standards that's going to be. The instrument that would drive missed an academic area. It for two years now we've been intentionally. Working with our teachers and principals. We spend millions of dollars park has been with this every step of the way you know park is like this note no persons like -- test. There are people behind here that are really willing to come down and work with you they'll be in our district. Next month working with us for a for a week. Every school have three teachers represented the principle we represented. So will begin to understand better how to test is constructed types of questions how we can build these questions into our regular lesson planning. We're excited about this week ago. That if we gonna compete we've got to raise standards in Louisiana we cannot be 49 out of fiftieth. If we do not move fall it will get further behind they'll not be a place to rest and a top fifty if illegals are realizing that. We can not be a Louisiana brand and less is competitive. With other states and other countries just recently shell. Is bringing in 300 engineers from outside this country to work in new Marlins that's 300 jobs. In its dam area that's students. One day will compete against we've got to get them ready today. Politics need to be separated in this day in this particular situation. Let's focus on what's best for education. I think you just hit the nail on the head in Germany if you want a pipe and it's it just seems to me that the governor is saying. His reasoning is. We don't want this federally. Shoved down our throats when well nothing to do with the -- well. You know you can't separate fences part of awful on the for finding children people that we have -- -- 80% of our children a considered to be free and reduced client which is an indicator. A -- family income. Yeah that's about a hundred million dollars a year from the federal government with it with it comes some -- we have to -- things that -- certainly the meet the letter of the law. But it doesn't destroy our flexibility doesn't destroy that creativity. Doesn't tell us what we have to teach it tells us that we have to perform which is a reasonable is reasonable expectations. When you receive some some type of federal dollars where do you think the governor is coming up with. That this is. This is the federal government intrusion. It it's a prominent read the QB on this from an elected a poll that just came out of the district last week where. Voters -- with with with issues mr. report to bill and once section then there will pursue -- nationally is that. In the and in the seventies and answer whether it's federal intrusion or take a well what whether that this issue a -- Think that that. Politicians who -- angles -- are trying to apply this label. To capitalize on the. -- -- -- into -- and that media to question why. Would you Europe's became an issue but. Public interest issue to the superintendent. In the success superintendent John YU center. Bessie pregnant Chad rover and they're all saying that they -- good move for but also to -- your email here but a leadership of the board of regents university presidents. Telling them to keep teaching the standards perk perk -- in terms of preparing teachers. To get to you know that your users -- Something you you have almost across the board. Officials who were were going to sound like they're just gonna keep the support despite with the governor's in. We but if we're gonna go ahead and do that and that's what I'm listening to that the two men in -- -- saying they're just gonna move forward to gonna give the test. But if there's no contract for the park test how do you do that tested dilemma -- that'll be a challenge we're being in case with we don't have an alternative. -- I think the closest example -- of the states have -- -- Indiana Indiana did not participate in common -- they dropped out. So they created their own test a test is basically the same -- park in terms of the assessment items and -- changed it defacing the cover. But it's very difficult to create a test. Is complex. Is. Is park is doing is it has to. It has for -- entire -- standard. And and a new way of measuring student is -- they said and Lessig has some level of validity to that we're just fooling ourselves you don't do this overnight. -- two years behind creating our own tests if with the intent to do that. And what and some peoples have one on you to stay with a leap tests. Again questions have to be field tested so. We brought the leap tests in 1999. And every leap tests had questions in at that would be used in subsequent years ago into the test. The Department of Education not to waste money -- field testing -- Other new -- questions -- numbered years ago so the short answer is there's no test and there's no set of questions seeking his. But it don't go back to your other question of how did this get so political prisoners a more concrete answer than just. If it's not just that they don't want government intrusion how did this get linked to government intrusion because in fact this is not at central oversight it was. Common core was put together by governors of states and its states have to adopt it they're not -- and states keep their own curriculum. The -- this -- under George W blush. Obama capped the initiative going and under -- to the top. He gave grants to these two consortiums to build the test and then the Tea Party started dumping this Obama war. That's when he got picked up. The only role the federal government has played in this was provides some funding to states and an incentive for them to come together. In consortium is to build the test because by leveraging. Number that the expertise of educators across the states by leveraging the use of money you have a much better tasked. And you would it each state tried to build a test on their -- because tests are expensive to build and they take a lot of time so that's how the issue. Became politicized. Everyone stay with -- we have to break for news but will come back and I really appreciate our callers will get to you stay with -- I'm Angela under the W well. We're back talking common core with god -- Jacobs doctor James makes -- superintendent of Jefferson schools. Stan Smith the interim superintendent of Orleans schools and Jeremy how offered with law politics. Talking about it you know is it a crisis that the governor has vetoed him. You know you superintendents are you saying what are we gonna do know you're saying we're gonna go ahead and teach it we gotta little problem of whether or not we're going to be able to give this to astronaut. I think the bigger issue is. What you said doctor makes -- witches we must be more competitive. And some of the criticism I heard not not a lot but a little bit of was well why do we want to just have this national. That's what would you -- sort of elaborate on why we need that. Well first of all I think it. We have to be sure that we're competing with the top states. We also have to not only national but I'm with international benchmarks as well it's being fed. But two levels of two systems one this national standards and -- international scene as we know that if we can prepare. Our students for a work -- to work with than a global economy that's in our city today they have we have to raise the bar to these standards. Massachusetts several years ago. Large to higher standards for their students. They did not do well for each year but would happen this year they've led the United States and the highest performance on international standards. Now they're looking at where they are into and we don't wanna -- the status quo we had a raise it one more level so there are moving forward and we try to get where they wore. So we we have got to be able to look at outside of us an order for us students to be prepared. We've got to look at a level of college and career readiness and I students can't compete it's a lot of concern this isn't for all students. Our students have to be literate all students have the reason all students have to problem solve all students have to. Communicate effectively regardless of what Korea patent. You either accept. And I think common -- brings that to us. OK let's go to one of our callers today than applause. Aberdeen. Out -- so why are we so all I'm ever. Actors now. Are probably not you know. Just go -- -- who don't even go -- teachers. So botnet that. Each seat curriculums and and it very -- and they're involved. Part of planet in Iraq how so how so all I'm here Rick. And and old people -- -- -- out of the petroleum and we were not there there this note. Put education is here that you noted this vote on. Day you know what we're gonna get an answer from these two men right here. Okay and I'll try first -- -- -- that that's one of the challenges. Obviously we have but you know one of the things that is critical is you know it and act are teachers are victimized. To some degree in and and one of the challenges our teachers have had is you know going through processes like this. That you know we get them to a point whether educated their crying and then we pulled the rug out from month room and we -- a different direction. Through you know through legislation and so it's critical that we get two points or you know we have. Consistency. In in what we're doing that we're benchmark against other states against globally. And so that we can make a determination of how well are we performing. You we have good teachers in in our systems you know after Katrina. -- -- our students went out you know and we found it yet there were reports coming back and our students had some challenges. But there were also reports coming back with respect our teachers that went and school systems in other states that they were performing. You know and an acceptable levels and sometimes it did better than acceptable levels so it's all a function of the tools we give -- in the support that we give them to do their jobs it's. That this critical to the performance teachers and also to the evaluation of those those teachers this. Adopting the common core standards in in in tandem with that an evaluation process to evaluate them on that performance is is critical. Two to the success to our school systems. You know this problem didn't begin this year as as you mentioned if he if you're a call in 1983. A nation at risk as publisher -- -- says that that. The United States has fallen. Behind other developed countries particularly academic standards shortly after that George Bush. Asked national goals which is the first aspect of national standards. That's followed Bill Clinton and unlike prepared to agree back then now they're their little or I guess sociable. But. That's at this stage of standards have been and Louisiana have really led. Had led the country and policy as it relates to high accountability and high standards. The challenge to us articulating it down to the grade level where you know that each grade level way a child should be able to do. In no and I think Concord brings us to an advanced level this has been a long process. That we did not want to fail at this time you're right we've got to stop. Learn from the past. Billed to the future. And I believe that. Common core is gonna help us get to that point where Louisiana is more competitive. For all of our student are -- -- number 49 you mentioned that earlier with well I'm -- standards I believe. It's it's shockingly we have about 25% of our students that need international benchmarks and Madson may be 24 and and literacy. Where will not. We're not 49 and I think where 45. Of forties okay but it's not good. Let's put this where we're -- playing in the bottom five OK so would we then just based on that agree that we need to do something. And that's an if you -- saying common core is worth the effort well we know that we have to racist -- Hello Fuller and not think one is I strongly support comic war. But I think it is nigh eve to say there's a silver bullet. In anything we did. On Massachusetts. Also has probably one of the highest percentages of college educated population. And we down. There's high correlations between student achievement and the education levels of their parents. So we are facing a generational. Issue of improving the expectations. And academic achievement markets. But you'll get better. By working on getting banner and if we don't adopt these if we don't. Raise the level of expectations. And what is being taught in the classroom we will only go from 45 to 5151. If you count. I think we actually at 51 jurisdictions. While I think as one reporter and and so and so that but go back -- Because for your. Our listeners. Where this battle ground is gonna go is to detest. I -- and I just think it's amendment because you know the headlines lie it's a complex issue but at the end of the day. The issue is can the governor suspend. The testing contract. If he does what happens. And if there is no testing -- agreed upon and we don't have a test and there's no way of measuring. How schools stead. In the 1415 academic year there's no way of signing lot of great no way in determining which kids get captures. You can lose 500 million dollars. A federal money so. We need to resolve this issue in some way shape or form over the next six months and I don't know how the state board of education. Can resolve the way the governor wants to because what the governor is asking is against the law passed by the legislature. That's a lot of information and that's a lot of important thoughts. On that we're gonna take a break and we're gonna come back and Jeremy I wanna hear your thoughts on it right after this once again we are sort of wrapping up an hour talk on what has happened with common core. Once the governor vetoed. And hey it's confusing but it's it's painful and I think -- Pretty much wrapped up where we are it is about the test but the fallout is tremendous -- Germany before we hang up I'd like. I Jeremy publisher editor of La weekly -- politics weekly your thoughts. I think what it would probably -- -- point. But it. Before -- caller that's -- it appeared in the want to and we did talk out. Is that. You know -- twelve educational you know has been under under. The superintendent John -- has gotten -- ways with the governor on this issue. There early age it was really strange even before. The government has decision last week you know also that they have that peace movement collaboration. -- important mrs. Howell. Elementary and secondary schools would receive their current state. Really become a political pull off -- the -- legislature. -- has passed a legitimate funding formula that's 1112 as. And then if you do licensing progress to the process that you become the deal making machines in had a the black caucus was able to leverage. A temporary delay and repeated the army and in the budget. The senators were able to negotiate with -- eager to get to him he task force backup running so. You know there's a lot of politics in the process -- it will Wear leveling it could point it does that. You weren't would come to Korea fully implement it is not -- -- shell eager despite the governor's efforts. So that the big story that's in the development to date up it is whether. The stated it was an average standard politically in mentioned the operator dollar figures really but that figure could be -- -- -- -- we don't know exactly yet. What's in jeopardy and it is there's one ever acted to I don't know which outlook on. Our program. And a -- there's there's a couple of doctors that that sources that the -- administration but Republican clips. -- the issues for our program -- -- Charlie -- to -- coming Corbett nowhere near. Nowhere near finished. Jeremy always appreciate you joining us very much I'd like to hear from mark to superintendents again bottom line and we have a caller we're not gonna have a chance to get to that she's asking correctly. Will the will this replace the leap tests and you were saying now yes and get -- yes that this. The -- test is gone. OK so the question is what tests do we have next year -- to replace okay. -- to review the superintendent of Orleans and Jefferson Parish -- you're going to continue to teach common core. When school starts -- in August August 9. We start and will continued to attack Wiki -- working that right now as we speak their people at our office and professional development seminars. This will continue to the first day of school are not resting and -- have a deeper understanding. In order to to us to do a better job of educating the students Jefferson Parish. And then we'll do the same will continue to teach to the and the curriculum would developed over the last five years that. There than meets the common -- standards and will be prepared if there is a change in testing we'll have to be prepared to deal with it when -- when that time occurrence but we're not. Change in course at this point. Some of the feedback that you'll have received an issue has been teaching it from teachers from parents and from the kids. Well with us is primarily we we -- large district we have about 3500 teachers. We have to extend our professional -- developed to be sure that every teacher fully understands where of the strategies that you needed. It's gonna raise a level of contents in -- former dean of education I can say that. We -- not prepared teachers in higher education teacher education program with a with a satisfactory Matt's program. To teach -- to middle school and high school level. We gonna have you did. To develop some contents specialist training. But I have to get deep ourselves and the content. As well as -- -- -- OG. And one time elementary was primarily pennant visually focused only on the child. Now you have to focus on the Tom also have a level of -- yourself to teach contest at a at a master level for children. So it's gonna be a shift in professional development. But we all gonna get stronger I think in terms of meeting the needs of common core and life threatening wrong but I think when Jerry was saying it. That the email that one out was going to the the college's teaching educators. Keep going with common core we have to you know we know that in Louisiana only 28%. Of those who enter college point 18%. Complete a two year four year program that's an awful awful -- any rate that's that's because our students are not. College ready. So it's very clear -- that the that the college yet border regions border supervises. Which strongly endorsed comical because they know that we have to better prepare our children have a better success rate college. Makes our viewers sleepless. A very clear understanding. -- chair Emmys and a little bit differently common quarry is not. It's gone -- day the standards are in place. Jesse has adopted him. And the irony is even in Indiana where they would truth from comic where they basically took the common core standards. Pretty did not and use in the concourse standards. Because that's apple pie and mother about what we need students to no -- be able to do as we move forward. I don't think that test. And and test drives instruction. In absolutely -- districts I hate that we're out of time I'm so appreciative of your time. Thank you so very much we will do another common -- as it evolved thank each and every one of you on the right.